Pump or Double?

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   Canvassing preferences for a "defense" shotgun... some like the pump, some like the double. I am most familiar with the 12 ga Rem 870 pump but did shoot a 12 ga "coachgun" for a bit in Cowboy Action. Gotta admit the double has a "mystique" about it. But then again, there's nothing to get your attention more than the "rack" of a 12 ga pump...

Marcus.

Edited by North Logan

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North Logan Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby aka The Legendary Lawman Joined: 10 June 2003 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1728	Topic: Pump or Double? Posted: 02 July 2003 at 06:30
	Canvassing preferences for a "defense" shotgun... some like the pump, some like the double. I am most familiar with the 12 ga Rem 870 pump but did shoot a 12 ga "coachgun" for a bit in Cowboy Action. Gotta admit the double has a "mystique" about it. But then again, there's nothing to get your attention more than the "rack" of a 12 ga pump... *Marcus.* Edited by North Logan
	"COLTS & PONY CARS"...

NH_Hunter Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby aka The Kid Joined: 13 June 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3508	Posted: 02 July 2003 at 12:51
	They have been using doubles as self defense since they were chambered for shotshells instead of muzzleloading shotguns. I guess it would depend on which you can handle better and can load faster. You cant outperform the followup shot of a double except with a semi auto, but you didnt ask about a semi auto. I would choose double as long as there werent too many of em. While your at it you should add in a nice single action revolver into the mix. Then it would get interesting. NH_Hunter
	Leverguns make me smile Proud Left Handed Shooter

CB900F Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Honor, Integrity Joined: 10 June 2003 Location: Eritrea Status: Offline Points: 8857	Posted: 02 July 2003 at 17:22
	Sir North; Don't know if you know this or not. Wilson combat bought Scattergun Technologies not too long ago. Get a current Wilson catalogue & learn to drool all over again. I went with the 870 Express extended mag home defense. Worked on the action bars a little myself, but nothing major needs to be done. One of these days, months, years, it may get to go to Arkansas. www.wilsoncombat.com 900F
	Birth certificate!? He don't need no steenkink birth certificate!!

TexasShooter Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Joined: 10 June 2003 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 323	Posted: 02 July 2003 at 18:21
	I would take my Rem 870 pump over a double any day of the week. I don't know exactly how much difference in follow up shots there may be with 2 shots, but I guarantee I can empty 5 out a pump faster than they can... I was just laughing at those guys who brought their $1500 over/unders and side by sides on the pheasant hunt last year. They spent more time with those guns draped over their shoulders than they did shooting. That's why I took 2 home and they took home none. You're right, Marcus. I think anybody that was breaking into a house would know the sound of that pump action.

NH_Hunter Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby aka The Kid Joined: 13 June 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3508	Posted: 03 July 2003 at 00:28
	I got my mom's Winchester 1300 Ranger compact as my self defense gun. I keep it on my gun rack. Lately, i have had my single shot shotty next to my bed near where i keep my ammo. Just in case! I have learned to pump that thing fast. I can also handle a 1903 springfield like it is a straight pull! NH_Hunter
	Leverguns make me smile Proud Left Handed Shooter

Spot shooter Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Left BSB in Disgrace Banned Joined: 19 June 2003 Location: Bahrain Status: Offline Points: 0	Posted: 03 July 2003 at 01:03
	NH, Ain't much things on this earth than that are more hair raisin than hearing a pump cycle in the dark when you know you should be there! Gives you the advantage in a couple of ways, if there a friend the get that extra second to ID themselves. IF not they don't know your age, if your scared, or if your high or low in the room. Got a good friend who took the firing pin out of his and leaves it in the closet. That's his first step for any strange bumps in the night. Also safe cause it's in open air, and any wonderin kid could get at it (although the kid's know gun's in his household). Spot

Kingpin Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby aka Old IronSides Joined: 01 July 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11716	Posted: 07 July 2003 at 15:03
	No offense Spot, but what would your friend do if things got bad? I mean, with no firing pin, he has an attractive club. I keep my 870a wrist length from my bed. It's mounted to the box springs and all I have to do is droop a hand down and I have it. I also keep it loades with 4 in the magazine tube, chamber empty hammer down and safety off. I don't like the thoutght of having to fumble with little controls in the dark. Then again, I don't have any small children to worry about either. I was just wondering what your friends plan was when the shit goes south. When dealing with crack heads, it happens a lot...........Kingpin
	There are times when a normal man must, spit in his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.

mr mom Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .30/06 SpringField Joined: 10 June 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 342	Posted: 07 July 2003 at 15:54
	way back when i read an artical about fixing up a 870 for home protection. a couple of things i remember is they cut a slot in the flipper. so if a shell gets jammed up from the mag. you could clear it faster with a knife or a screwdriver. then on the forend they took a small wood chisel and cut grooves so you could grip the wood better. some of the old 870s had ribs instead of checkering. then of course there was the tube ext.
	mr mom

Kingpin Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby aka Old IronSides Joined: 01 July 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11716	Posted: 08 July 2003 at 11:18
	Al, it's called a flex tab and the offer a kit for a "small fee" It also replaces the slide, under the bolt. It works VERY well. I have one in my shotgun and have never had a stutter since......Kingpin
	There are times when a normal man must, spit in his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.

Deputy Al Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .22 LongRifle Joined: 27 July 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 54	Posted: 27 July 2003 at 08:08
	I would use a double gun, but can't get the fore-end to cycle. :-) I'm a huge believer in the Rem 870--mine has rifle-sighted 20" barrel and eight-shot tube extender. It rides in the trunk of my car at work (plain car/plain clothes), and I prefer it to the "cut-down" (14" bbls.) in our marked units. With the Foster slugs we carry, this rig will keep all shots inside the 8-ring on a B-27 silhouette at 100 yards. You are correct--that slide activation is a HUGE disincentive. I have twice seen subjects urinate involuntarily when the action got racked in tense circumstances.
	Deputy Al

Guests Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Guest	Posted: 28 July 2003 at 06:42
	Here is some food for thought. What if, when you "rack" your pump, all the while enjoying that unique sound, your potential attacker: 1) Does not panic. Some do. Some don't. 2) Uses that sound to locate you. 3) Opens fire. The potential attacker, who knows, may or may not be better armed than you. And there may or may not be more than one of them coming for you. Racking for effect, like turning on a flashlight at night, especially if you hold it in front of your torso, both come with pluses and minuses. This is where you, I hope, take some time to think this sort of stuff through so that when crunch time comes you are at least making informed choices. Key: Being sure of who or what you are shooting at. You do not, ever, want to open fire only to find out later that you have shot the wrong person, such as a friend or loved one trying, for all the right reasons, to surprise you, or a law enforcement officer who may already be quietly engaged in trying to apprehend your potential attacker or attackers. CJ PS - I choose, because of where and how I live, personally, to keep my self defense guns loaded and with a round in the chamber. The first sound any of them are going to make, once I have identified my target, is: Bang.

NH_Hunter Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby aka The Kid Joined: 13 June 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3508	Posted: 28 July 2003 at 08:30
	I keep my self defense ammo close at hand, but not in the chamber becuase i have friends that i dont trust. My handgun is in my nightstand in one drawer, and the ammo is in the drawer directly below it. It is probably one of the worst things for a kid to have a self defense weapon, they will say that i did it becuase i played to many video games. NH_Hunter
	Leverguns make me smile Proud Left Handed Shooter

CB900F Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Honor, Integrity Joined: 10 June 2003 Location: Eritrea Status: Offline Points: 8857	Posted: 28 July 2003 at 15:21
	CJ; No, offense, but I've yet to hear mention of an LEO engaged in LEO work who can keep his mouth shut. I think the 'may already be quietly engaged in trying to apprehend your potential attacker or attackers' is a bit far-fetched. Particularly when all parties except yourselft would know for sure that they are not on 'home ground'. If nothing else, you should smell the donuts. 900F
	Birth certificate!? He don't need no steenkink birth certificate!!

Guests Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Guest	Posted: 29 July 2003 at 05:18
	The potential scenario I described was prefaced with the word "may" for good reason. Now, not being a law enforcement officer myself, but coming from a family that included both a Town Marshall and an Under Sheriff, I'll leave this discussion to those more qualified than I to comment on 900F's remarks. CJ

CB900F Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Honor, Integrity Joined: 10 June 2003 Location: Eritrea Status: Offline Points: 8857	Posted: 29 July 2003 at 12:50
	CJ; That's like saying; 'If I buy this ticket, I may win the lottery'. That's a true enough statement, on either your post or mine. But the odds are waaaay long. 900F
	Birth certificate!? He don't need no steenkink birth certificate!!

Guests Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Guest	Posted: 30 July 2003 at 10:15
	If you are looking for a discussion, I'm sorry but I simply don't understand what you are trying to discuss with me. CJ

Kingpin Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby aka Old IronSides Joined: 01 July 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11716	Posted: 31 July 2003 at 11:45
	NH, you better do your homework. Shotguns have always been used for self defense ever since they were invented. Early in the Civil War, many southerners carried muzzle loading shotguns into the early battles. In Vietnam, there was a flachette load for the 105 MM howitzer that was used to great effect. Shotguns have been used for a couple of centuries and it didn't matter if they were muzzle loaders or cartridge guns. Look it up, it happened.........Kingpin
	There are times when a normal man must, spit in his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.

North Logan Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby aka The Legendary Lawman Joined: 10 June 2003 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1728	Posted: 02 August 2003 at 04:24
	Postscript.... looks like I'll be an 870 man. I sold off my coachgun pictured above and now just have my trusty ole Rem 870. Mine's an older one, 2 3/4" shells, passed down to me by a great uncle. I changed out the 30" barrel and installed a new "Express" 20" tube with rifle sites. Not going to put on an extended mag, just leave it the way it is. This'll be the "camper" gun for our summer trips in the trailer. *Marcus.*
	"COLTS & PONY CARS"...

Kingpin Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby aka Old IronSides Joined: 01 July 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11716	Posted: 04 August 2003 at 11:03
	A solid choice NL.............Kingpin
	There are times when a normal man must, spit in his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.

NH_Hunter Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby aka The Kid Joined: 13 June 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3508	Posted: 04 August 2003 at 11:17
	I stand corrected Kingpin . When i eventually get my hunting shotgun i might just get a short barrel for it so as when it is not going after bunnies and birds, it will be good medicine for burgalars NH_Hunter
	Leverguns make me smile Proud Left Handed Shooter