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.308 Load Development

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deaddog View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote deaddog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 March 2009 at 01:02

I don't think short yardage work is a waste of time. If you are working with iron sites or low power scopes I think it is a must. Since you don't have a lead sled or fancy rest it is much easier to call a pulled shot at short range. If you are the cause and not the load you may never know it at longer ranges. This is not to say long range work isn't needed. Short range can more easily weed out the lackluster performing loads.  I understand that some long target bullets take some time to stabilize but you will seldom if ever see a load that will group at 200 yards and not at 50yds.

DD

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 March 2009 at 03:12

"....some long target bullets take some time to stabilize ". 

Got to disagree with this.  I see a lot of people saying that they shoot 3' groups at 100 yards and then the bullet stablizes to a 2" group at 200 yards.  Just can't happen...never.

You might shoot a 2" group at 100 yards, and that has to be at least 4" at 200 yards.  And the usual is it will be 5" at 200 yards with wind, etc.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote deaddog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 March 2009 at 05:40

Ahh. The Bullsh^t flag has been thrown at me. I retract my statement."....some long target bullets take some time to stabilize ".  It's been a long time since I was up to speed on my college physics and I sometimes mix up my aviation related aerodynamics which correlate but not always exactly to the gyroscopic stability of projectiles. Here's my take on it. The preccessional destabilization of a longer heavier bullet caused by gyroscopic and aerodynamic forces is more likely to be dampend out by it's greater inertia than a shorter lighter bullet. The longer one will just take more time and distance to do it. Where I've seen this isn't really group size but group location. At 25yds the group my be at the 4 o'clock position on the target and at 200yds the group may be at 10 o'clock. My deduction and that's all it is. Is that while the bullet is rotating around it's axis it is also rotating around the axis of the bore but at a much slower rate. This effect has been noticed by me more with long for caliber bullets. In my defense I never claimed larger groups shrinking to smaller at longer ranges. I'll shut up now.

DD

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 24mod12 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 November 2009 at 02:16
Originally posted by TasunkaWitko TasunkaWitko wrote:

starting with .308 development tonight for my herter's mj9 in .308 with sightron s1 3-9x40mm scope.

i have IMR 4064, IMR 4831, RL15 and varget; i can get IMR 4895 if needed.

several different brands of brass, separated, including winchester, PMC, Lake City, federal and i think remington. - even have maybe 20 herters.

an ample supply of CCI primers (am holding on to 200 CCI BR primers for use when i find "the load").

As for bullets, I am looking primarily at 150grn sierra pro hunters and 165grn sierra gamekings.

CH "H" press, lee deluxe collet die set, lee factory crimp die and lee auto prime make up the primary equipment - cases will be prepped by with trimming and chamfering following sizing. i don't have a flash hole deburring tool or primer pocket uniformer - may have to sneak a couple of things into the shopping cart next time we are in great falls?

will consult manuals (lyman, hornady and lee plus the "load book" with data from everyone) tonight for starting loads - suggestions will be welcomed!

My friends and I have purchased a lot of Nosler Blem bullets from www.bivwak.com (auction site) {they have free shipping on some items & flat rate $10 shipping on a bag or lots of bags}and www.shootersproshop.com (top of page box type in bulk bullets takes you to other sales sites for consignment weapons,etc.).They are starting their second gun auction.They had one of 100 rifles,handguns & shotguns up for bid for the month of October!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote robk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2009 at 03:23

being that my main hunting and shooting target is with a 308 encore i have found two powders i use which are varget and 4350 both have produced sub .5" moa. i have found that for hunting deer and smaller game or black bear i use the 150 speer 150 spbt. i played with the loads but found my best bet was at the highest load level or one grain below. i prefer to keep my loads to myself as i know each rifle will have different loads that will work for them. if you would like the loads just give me a heads up and i will get the loads for you/. varget and imr 4350 were made for the 308 caliber

hope this helps

rob k

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TasunkaWitko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2009 at 06:50

hey guys -

this might sound pathetic, but i still need to evaluate those laods i came up with back in frreakin' MARCH! after hunting season i am planning some weekend trips to the range as well as some laoding. the kids are pretty excited about shooting and loading right now and this is a good opportunity to do some development.

robk - thanks for the offer - i'll see how these loads go and will get back to you ~

ron

TasunkaWitko - Chinook, Montana

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Montana Maddnes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 December 2009 at 16:37

Well Taz

Of course this load was developed for my rifle, and may not do crap in your. But in my Rem 788

Wincherster Brass

Federal primer

42gr IMR4064

165gr Nosler Balistic Tip, or Barnes X

This load works very well in mine!

Montana Maddness
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 December 2009 at 20:37

DD I agree with your later statement.  The rotational group at various ranges is a fact, I don't think it is as wide as 4".

I hear people say my gun shoots 2 inches at 100 yards, and the same rifle shoots 1.5 inches at 200 yards because of the bullet stabilizing.  Physically impossible, but the gun writers keep repeatedly  writing it, and it is all over the internet.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Irish Bird Dog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 January 2010 at 04:02

Tas.....the Lake City Brass is military and most likely will have thicker case walls ie less powder capacity than commercial brass......not a real issue just an FYI but a military primer is crimped in place and that primer pocket usually needs to be de-crimped to fit primers back in easily. 

Out of the past ie HISTORY: I have an old loading "tool" called a "Powley Computer" that is a cardboard slide rule type gizmo that you can set for bullet wt, bullet dia. maybe the velocity you want etc  (ain't used it in years, can't remember exactly what is entered into the data slides) but it helps find a starter powder for your load if you follow the instructions just to get you on the right track. Only thing is it is obsolete now cuz of so many newer powders since it was designed but would still work for the powders of its time. I think the guy who designed it was Homer Powley & musta been a ballistician or some such thing.  Wonder if anyone else remembers about that tool.  Today there must be computerized programs to use for the same info.  Check with the powder companies and bullet makers.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tattoo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 January 2010 at 06:02
Use 46 grains of R 15 ,150 grn bullet and forget the rest. I've shot a .308 of some kind for 40 yrs. My 99 savage will drive tacks with that load as has most other rifles I've used it in. Killed a lot of game with the load
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 January 2010 at 06:34

IBD, yep remember the Powley Calculator...and I have one!

He made other calculators and I have some of those also.  I undestand his wifle had a web site with some of that stuff.  But is is a handly tool, just have to calibrate it with burn rates, and use it AS A GUIDE.

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